Balanced Bites Podcast #119: white potatoes, natural sweeteners & calcium supplements

Podcast Episode #119: White potatoes, natural sweeteners & calcium supplements
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1.  Beyond Sugar Detox news, events and updates [3:48]Podcast Episode #119: White potatoes, natural sweeteners & calcium supplements
2.  The white potato debacle [8:27]
3.  Excerpt from Eat the Yolks [15:38]
4. Weight gain methods for overall health [18:27]
5.  Opinions on natural sweeteners [28:58]
6.  Sardines in the car [43:00]
7.  The best calcium supplement [50:42]
Upcoming events
The 21 Day Sugar Detox Cookbook
Eat the Yolks by Liz Wolfe
Primal Palate Cookies

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Liz Wolfe: Hey everyone! Welcome to episode 119 of the Balanced Bites podcast. A quick word about our sponsors. Paleo Treats. Everybody loves a good paleo treat. Well, maybe not everyone, but, if you gonna hate you can move on! Uh, I don’t trust people who don’t like dessert, Diane. Anyway; you, our lucky listeners, get 15% off when you enter the code BALANCEDBITES at checkout. Be sure to add a few of the new Bandito bars to your order; you will not regret that decision. Next up, Pete’s Paleo, bringing fine dining to your cave. Pete’s Paleo is your number one source for premade paleo meals that are all made from the best quality proteins and veggies sourced locally and sustainably. That is what makes them super humanly awesome. Which is…
Diane Sanfilippo: The bomb.
Liz Wolfe: The bomb. That is a real phrase, P. S., Super-humanly awesome. Pete’s Paleo bacon is meat and amazing. It is what bacon should be. Pete’s Paleo is offering our listeners a free pound of bacon with the purchase of any meal plan. And that offer is valid through December 31st of this year, closing in rapidly. The code is BALANCEDBITESROCKS, all one word. And finally, Chameleon Cold-Brew. Check out all the varieties available for order on their website if you don’t see it in a store near you, which, if it is near you, you are lucky and you should buy it there, and then you should Instagram it, and then you should tag us so we can see it. I’m especially loving the mocha right now. It’s, just, extraordinary. The discount for our listeners is BALANCEDBITES. Cool.
Diane Sanfilippo: I have to give a little shout out too. I’ve been mixing my Chameleon Cold-Brew with some Eating Evolved hot cocoa.
Liz Wolfe: Mmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m even mixing the mocha, like, double-whammy chocolate party.
Liz Wolfe: You’re disgusting. You’re not paleo.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} It’s amazing. Anyway.
Liz Wolfe: Chocolate on chocolate. Dang!
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: That’s no joke. So, what’s going on in your neck of the woods. D-Sizzle.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, boy. Alright, let me go through my list o’updates. Well, let’s see. So, this show will air actually, what, the day after Christmas.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm. Merry Christmas!
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah! {laughs} I liked that video.
Liz Wolfe: I don’t think I could… did you see the quote part in the outtakes?
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, of course.
Liz Wolfe: “Do the red rider carbine action” yeah, I’m not going to do it. If you want to see me quote one of the best quotes from the best Christmas movie of all time, go over to my website,, and look at the review for Paleo Happy Hour. It’s pretty amazing.
Diane Sanfilippo: I just like watching videos of you.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: Because, then I get to laugh, and like…
Liz Wolfe: At me or with me.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yes.
Liz Wolfe: {Laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I think with you. I think you’re pretty much laughing at yourself.
Liz Wolfe: You’re a grotsky little biotch.
1. Beyond Sugar Detox news, events and updates [3:48]
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} So, I mean, hopefully people are, I don’t know, driving home from wherever they’re spending Christmas or the holidays, and maybe we are giving you something a little extra to listen to this week with this new episode. So, yeah, this will air right after Christmas, so want to remind people that we’ll be kicking off a huge group for The 21-Day Sugar Detox in January. I put out a question on Facebook today asking folks if they’d rather start January 1st or January 6th, because we typically start a new group the first Monday of every month, and that’s because I like people to have a weekend before they start to prepare very well, and one of the big things in the Sugar Detox book is that I have this, like, 7 days ahead, 5 days, 3 days, yadda yadda, preparation list. And I think it’s really, really critical that folks prepare instead of this kind of, you know, day before deciding I’m going to start the Sugar Detox tomorrow, because I think that doesn’t really set you up for success in the best way possible. So, the consensus seems to be falling more towards the January 6th start date. But, that being said, you can start the 1st or any time you like. There will be a blog post up at some point soon, just kind of review how to “join” a group. There’s not like a super technical situation that goes on there, but we do have a free E-mail series that you can get, and you can select your own start date for those, so you do need to have it start a day in the future. You can’t have it start retroactively. So, there’s that. Beyond Sugar Detox program is a-coming! {laughs} We are just kind of wrapping up some of the final touches on that, and that is basically a complementary program for The 21-Day Sugar Detox. It’s a bunch of additional materials. We have, I think, 22 or 23 days of audio files. So, sort of like mini-podcast episodes with myself in some of them and also the Sugar Detox moderators just talking about what they’ve seen and ways to kind of support you along the way. What to expect and all of that. And, that program will sort of be the replacement for the old online version of the Sugar Detox. So the people who were used to getting those updates now and then, having a program that kind of consistently gets expanded, that will be the place for it, and I’m really excited to be able to do that again, because I love being able to just add resources and not have to worry that it has to go into a separate book. So, you know, this way I can just kind of keep adding stuff, and you’ll just have kind of signed up for it once and you’ll be able to get all of that. So, that’s that. If you are in Florida, tomorrow I will be; so, tomorrow, Friday the 27th, I will be in Naples signing books at Crossfit Redline. Check out the event details on the right hand side of the website for that. And then January 4th, so that will be next weekend, holy cats! That’s my Rob Wolf-ism.
Liz Wolfe: Holy cats!
Diane Sanfilippo: My Robb Wolf-ism for the day! Holy cats, that’s next weekend! So, all day here in Fairfield, New Jersey, we will be teaching a Balanced Bites seminar. That will be Dr. Scott and I teaching that, so that will be a lot of fun. And, if you live in the area, especially, definitely come check out Brazen Athletics, where we’ll be hosting the event. Because it’s an amazing gym! What else? Stay tuned for more dates. We have the whole west coast tour coming up, and then, hint, hint, if you live in Texas, stay tuned for information coming for the end of February on dates near you. And tomorrow, I’m heading to Florida. 80 degrees can’t come soon enough. {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: {accented} Flarida?
Diane Sanfilippo: {accented} Flarida!
Liz Wolfe: You’re headed to Flarida.
Diane Sanfilippo: Where they don’t have basements {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh.
Diane Sanfilippo: Do you remember that?
Liz Wolfe: Yes.
Diane Sanfilippo: We learned that last year.
Liz Wolfe: That blows my mind.
Diane Sanfilippo: We were like, what do you mean not… huh?
Liz Wolfe: It blows my mind.
Diane Sanfilippo: It’s crazy. So what’s up with you?
Liz Wolfe: Well, I feel like I’m kind of just in the calm before the storm here, just trying to get prepared and organized for the book launch and for all the projects that we have to come together, Diane, the seminars and the online seminar we’re working on and, I must say I’m very excited about some, what else, some big editions to the Purely Primal Skincare Guide. That, if you already own the Purely Primal Skincare Guide, these will go out to you as well. So, if you already have it and you’re worried about an update and not getting it, you will get it. It will be emailed to you. And, other than that, all the plans we have for the homestead. We’re trying to get prepared for the spring, which I know will be here before we know it, so lots of great stuff to come in the New Year. I’m excited. Other than that,
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m eating, so go ahead and keep talking. {laughs}
2. The white potato debacle [8:27]
Liz Wolfe: You’re eating? Ok, well, ok, well let’s talk about… let’s talk about what we eat for a second. I put on my Facebook page for my blog {laughs} yesterday something that garnered the most likes and comments I think I’ve ever had, and I was just stunned. I didn’t think it would matter so much to people, but I think I got something like 2500 likes within a few hours of posting that I prefer real mashed potatoes to mashed cauliflower. PEW!! Like, I don’t know, some people’s worlds ended, I think, when I posted that. And I feel compelled to say to people that I eat mashed white potatoes on a fairly regular basis.
Diane Sanfilippo: Nerd.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} I know. I don’t feel like I have to justify that choice.
Diane Sanfilippo: No.
Liz Wolfe: To me, the fact that white potatoes were ever “not allowed” on any variation of any paleo style eating plan is kind of ridiculous. Unless, of course unless, you have a problem metabolizing them, you have a sensitivity to nightshades, or you need, for reasons for metabolic disorder, you need to go on a low carb diet. I get that. But it’s kind of like saying guns don’t kill people, people kill people.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} Potatoes don’t …
Diane Sanfilippo: Wow.
Liz Wolfe: Well, I mean, it might be a little ridiculous, but in my opinion there’s really nothing wrong with white potatoes.
Diane Sanfilippo: Right.
Liz Wolfe: And quite honestly sweet potatoes, to me, I love them, I love them, you know, for breakfast, whatever, they are a little too sweet!
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: And I like white potatoes because they are a little more neutral. They are a great vehicle for butter. And, I don’t know,
Diane Sanfilippo: And duck fat.
Liz Wolfe: And duck fat. I’m down with the white potatoes. I just don’t think; you know, if you like mashed cauliflower, that’s cool, but I was thinking about this the other day. There’s really, nutritionally, cauliflower is in no way superior to white potatoes, in my opinion, for anyone that can use the carbohydrate from potato. I mean, yes, there are absolutely starchy, but…
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, they have different nutrients that they’ll provide.
Liz Wolfe: But they have nutrients, that’s the thing.
Diane Sanfilippo: Right.
Liz Wolfe: So, I eat white potatoes. You know, come and tell me I’m not paleo, that’s fine. But I think, especially when people get my book and they read through, you know, what I have to say on this lifestyle and seeking nutrients and everything we talk about on this podcast I think will understand that the paleo world is bigger whether potatoes are ok or not.
Diane Sanfilippo: Indeed.
Liz Wolfe: Word.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh. Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: What?
Diane Sanfilippo: No, nothing, I just was like, talking and eating and unsure if I muted or unmated.
Liz Wolfe: {laughing} You’re unmated.
Diane Sanfilippo: I’ve only had this microphone for 2 years, and I still don’t know how to use it {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: My expensive microphone is sitting in a box somewhere from when we moved 6 months ago.
Diane Sanfilippo: Nice.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Sorry.
Diane Sanfilippo: So.
Liz Wolfe: Any thoughts on that? What are you eating? Right now. Are you eating potatoes?
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m eating raw potatoes. No, I’m kidding.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: So, I actually, I love mashed cauliflower. I think it’s more of a puree. I don’t think of cauliflower puree as a replacement for mashed potatoes, I think it’s different. Like, if you go to a fancy restaurant; there’s actually this one restaurant in Pittsburg called Cure, which is known for having tons of amazing cured meats, which I love and we get often, but they serve their; whatever their proteins are, their main dishes always come with like two or three different kinds of purees. It’s just a weird thing. I’m like, I’m eating steak and, it seems like baby food with it.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} It’s just a really strange thing. But they all taste amazing. It will be like caramelized onions and cauliflower or celery root, things like that. Anyway, so I just think mashed cauliflower, or cauliflower puree, has a really light, creamy texture to it that I enjoy, and, if I don’t want or need all of the carbs from potatoes, I do enjoy having that sort of like, creamy texture of that dish. That being said, if I wanted more carbohydrate, I’d eat the potatoes. You know?
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: And that’s me. And like you said, if somebody can’t do nightshades or too much starch doesn’t feel great for them, or doesn’t work well for them, you know, with whatever their goals are, then don’t do it. But, anyway. I don’t know. I mean, my family is surprisingly, like, when I’ve served mashed cauliflower or cauliflower puree at a holiday dinner, it’s not like I’m trying to fool anyone, but they all love it and it always goes and I’m always wishing that I had made more because it goes really, really quickly.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: And, you know, {laughs} to my own credit, I must, you know, I don’t know, I make it well. I add plenty of seasoning and fat, and I think, you know, I think there’s something to be said for the fact that if somebody makes it and it doesn’t come out and taste good, I mean, I can’t always just say, it’s the fact that it was mashed cauliflower that did it. I mean, if you’re not seasoning the food you’re making, and you don’t add any fat to it, I can’t promise you that it’s going to taste amazing. I know that sounds like weird or random, but you can screw up mashed potatoes too. They can come out gummy if you screw it up.
Liz Wolfe: Gluey.
Diane Sanfilippo: They can be gooey or lumpy, or… I mean, part of it is learning how to do this, and great cauliflower puree, you know, you take the cauliflower right after it’s steamed, you steam the bejeezus out of it so it’s super, super soft, like pretty much falling apart. You take it right when it’s still hot, has tons of moisture in it, and if you steam it with some kind of chicken stock in the basket, you know underneath the basket, that’s going to even give it more flavor, puree it right away, salt, pepper, maybe truffle salt instead of regular salt, and either butter or ghee, and that tastes amazing. So, that’s what I think about it.
Liz Wolfe: Fine with me.
Diane Sanfilippo: And what am I eating right now? I just ate a can of sardines, which I always think of you
Liz Wolfe: Awww.
Diane Sanfilippo: When I eat my sardines. Uh, and I like them drowning in my Kasandrinos olive oil with hot sauce and my Real Salt. I have this thing, I like them kind of salty. And I’m eating frozen cherries that have defrosted. I don’t know why, I just like them.
Liz Wolfe: That sounds good. Well, I just ate some chili.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oooh. You made chili?
Liz Wolfe: Well, my husband made chili.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Ok.
Liz Wolfe: Yesterday. Yesterday, we went and tailgated the Chief’s game. The Chief’s. I don’t know an appropriate way to say that they screwed the pooch every which way from Sunday, but they stunk.
Diane Sanfilippo: You sound disappointed.
Liz Wolfe: It was like negative 5 degrees outside, I had heating packs in my shoes, and I needed a win, man. I needed a win. We didn’t get it. Colts fans, you won. You won this time. We’ll see you in Indy.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Oh boy.
Liz Wolfe: Oh boy. You’re like, football?
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I’m like I’m sleeping.
Liz Wolfe: You’re like, which team is your team? What color?
Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t even know what you’re saying.
Liz Wolfe: Ok.
Diane Sanfilippo: {Charlie Brown adult voice} Wa-wa-waah.
3. Excerpt from Eat the Yolks [15:38]
Liz Wolfe: {Charlie Brown adult voice} Wa-wa-wa. Moving right along. So, before we get started with questions, and we’re almost there, we got really good feedback, or at least I did, about doing a little weekly reading from my upcoming book, starts shipping at the end of February, but it’s available for preorder now. It’s called Eat the Yolks. So, I think we’ll continue to do that many weeks. Not all, but most weeks. And I’ll just do a quick reading today from the chapter on nutrients, the section on vitamin D. And Diane, P.S., a lot of people were contacting me saying I vote for an audio book, you should read {laughs} read your own book on audio. So, maybe that will happen.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I voted for that.
Liz Wolfe: You vote. You vote yes. Alright, so.
Diane Sanfilippo: My vote counts more than once.
Liz Wolfe: Ok, fine.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: That’s fine.
Diane Sanfilippo: Because I’ll submit it. I’ll call, like, over and over as if I’m voting for the next American Idol.
Liz Wolfe: We should set it up that way for sure, actually.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: You can vote as many times as you want. Alright. Here we go. “It’s a far different thing to look like a cast member of Jersey Shore, or a piece of tanned leather than it is to have healthy levels of sun stimulated vitamin D. The good news is, the alternatives to sunscreen are not frying, fist pumping on the boardwalk, or getting cancer. It’s simply informed, conscientious, responsible sun exposure….” Thereafter I launch into a long explanation of how, why, and when to strategize your sun exposure and the ins and outs of getting vitamin D from the sun, etc, and I continue with the following: “Another lesson of history and biology. Nature provides everything we need to be healthy; whoever we are and wherever we come from. That said, many of us live in parts of the world where sun exposure doesn’t accord with our skin tone. Darker skinned people living in northerly climates are more prone to vitamin D deficiency, and those with very fair skin living closer to the equator have the highest rates of skin cancer. That’s a bit of a bummer, especially for people of northern descent living in, say, Miami. But, that’s nature for you. She’s always providing. But she doesn’t care that you want to spend your summer in a thong on South Beach.” End Scene.
Diane Sanfilippo: That’s how I’ll be spending the next week.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} You jerk. In “Flarida”.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} That’s as funny as I can possibly be.
Liz Wolfe: It’s hilarious. I’m laughing on the inside.
Diane Sanfilippo: Hilarious is my new favorite word. Did I mention that last week? I’m not sure.
Liz Wolfe: No, I don’t think so. My new favorite word is tush, I mentioned that last week.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: But from there; P.S. everyone; from there, in the book, I offer a lot of information on the sun and sun exposure and sun safety as well as a lot of the myths and truths about sun exposure and cancer. So, that’s one of my favorite sections in the book. Cool.
Diane Sanfilippo: Woop, woop!
4. Weight gain methods for overall health [18:27]
Liz Wolfe: Woop, woop! Alright, let’s move on to questions. This question, first question, is from Brian. “Dear Diane and Liz. Thank you for your wonderful podcast and books. I’m wondering if there are any potential downsides of eating with the intent to gain muscle mass, especially for those who have a hard time gaining muscle. I’m your typical hard gainer. 6 foot 1, 155 pounds, male, age 29. The usual recommendation is to eat more and lift weights, but I’ve found that in order to gain weight, I have to eat well past the point of satiety. While this might be helpful for muscle gain, would you be concerned that eating this way for a lifetime might be counterproductive as far as health and longevity are concerned, or alternatively, is gaining muscle that important for the overall health for someone as skinny as I am? I would only want to pursue weight gain if it is supportive of overall health. Thank you for any thoughts you might have.” I really like this question, and I know we’ve covered it a couple of times previously. Potentially, you can find that by searching the archives, but I liked how concise and direct this question was, and I think the answer is, yeah, I think there could be some counterproductive, you know, aspects to doing this for a long, long, long, long time, when it’s not working. So, I do believe there is a point where you can, I don’t know if the right phrase is to change your body chemistry, but you can, I believe, kind of change that set point where you’re able to keep a little bit more muscle on and you’re able to tolerate a little bit more food without feeling like you are overfeeding 100% of the time. But if you never get to that point, say 6 months down the road it’s still the exact same, you know, issue that you were trying to tweak or to change, I think maybe it’s time to reconsider. So, those are my I think most important points, but Diane, what do you think about this?
Diane Sanfilippo: I think also, part of it like you said, down the road, 6 months, so… I mean, my boyfriend, I don’t know that I’d call him a hard gainer, but he’s definitely a very, like, tall lean build. {clears throat} Excuse me, and historically, I think the only other time in his life he was the weight he’s at now was when he was like lifting weights and eating a lot but eating unhealthy foods.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: This was, you know, way longer ago and he was much younger and probably had, you know, a lot more testosterone. I mean, it’s just a guess, just based on how, you know, maybe 18-year-old guys and young 20s versus mid 30s kind of have their hormonal balance. But, I think what we’ve seen with him is that, you know, just in general consistently making sure that he’s eating a little bit more than maybe he would have. If we go to divide, you know, whatever we’ve cooked up, and he initially takes 2 chicken thighs and I take 2 chicken thighs, or whatever it is, it’s like, ok there is still more there, go grab another one {laughs} you know, after you finish that, and just consistently a little bit more food at each meal, because one thing that I see a lot with these “hard gainer types” or the folks who are just naturally leaner, and this is completely observational, just based on the people that I know in my life and some who I’ve coached, as well, they just have a tendency to not eat as much. And I know that sounds obvious and sort of basic, but I can eat a lot of food. And I’m not like a lean hard gainer type, and I think… I do think that there are different types of us out there who just have, I don’t know, for whatever reason, I’m not an expert on this whole subject, but I just think some of us have an easier propensity to eating more food, even perhaps past satiety. Maybe we just find a lot of pleasure in eating, maybe there is something broken with our hormones. Maybe we just, um, I don’t know why we do that, and I’m not, like, overweight, it’s just that it’s not that hard for me to eat a little bit extra if I wanted to, and at the same time, plenty of people out there, I know you and I Liz have, you know, over the years of doing this podcast, you know, we’ve said to some people, well, if you’re looking to cut back a little bit, just pay attention. You know, is your portion of protein 8 ounces and it could really be 6 and you’d be satisfied with that 6, but you’ve been just taking 8 because that’s what you take? You know, and really tuning into that. So, the flip side of that is, maybe you would naturally take a 6 ounce portion of something. Grab an extra 2 ounces. It doesn’t mean that you need to eat 2 steaks at every meal. Does that make sense?
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: So, over time, just consistently paying attention to, oh, maybe I should eat a little bit more here, and not just more broccoli, you know, {laughs} like that’s not what’s really going to do it. A little more protein and a little more fat. Same thing, like, you know I’ll watch Scott put olive oil in his salad dressing, and I’m like, no honey. {laughs} I’m just like,
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} I’m like, you’re going to need more dressing, and I’m just adding it. And what’s funny is that, you know, that’s his natural way of moving through life, but he’s happy to have gained, like, 15 pounds in the year we’ve been dating because it’s all muscle. You know, he’s lifting heavier, and just consistently eating more. Just not, like I said, it’s not a second steak. Do you know what I mean?
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: So it’s just that little bit, and kind of tuning into it. And I do think that can be a healthy way to do it, when you’re just adding a little bit all the time, and I agree with you that, you know, focusing on a mission of just gaining weight and mass for the sake of it, and consistently overeating, you know, to some kind of uncomfortable place. Maybe it’s not even financially {laughs} maintain, you know, something you can maintain. Or, it’s just gorging yourself all the time. You know, just kind of stuffing food in just for the sake of it. I don’t think that’s a healthy way to go. So, I think if you are going to approach something like this where you’re looking to gain weight over time, it should be a very gradual thing, and I think you should tune into the fact that you may be one of those people who just doesn’t eat a lot at a meal in the first place, so your portions may just be a little bit shy in general. I mean, 6’1”, 155 is a very slight stature.
Liz Wolfe: Very slender.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, very slender. I mean, like, he’s got a lot of room on that frame to put on some weight. So, I do think, you know, when people say “eat more and lift weights”, it might be that. It might be that, ok, well if you want to do it in a healthy way, pay attention to how much you’re eating. This is another case, sometimes, for not weighing and measuring, but maybe entering your food into a calculator where you’re like, ok, I bought a pound of beef, and I ate half of it at this mean, and I ate a cup or two of these veggies. Enter it into a day, you know, on Fitday or whatever, see how many calories you’re eating because you may be shocked to find that you’re under eating. That’s a really common thing that happens, so.
Liz Wolfe: Here’s something I talk about a ton in my book, and some people are going to disagree with that, and I’m sure I’ll take some flak for what I say, but my argument in the book is that we kind of mistake the laws of thermogenesis and how they work with regards to calories and energy production in the body and I kind of break down how we actually generate energy as not just a function of our nutrition, because we actually need a ton of nutrients to generate ATP, and really that’s our energetic currency. Like, that’s what we take to the energetic bank. And I talk about the real, what we really need to think about, whether we want to gain or lose weight or just kind of know the way our body works a little bit better because I really, I do contend that calorie counting for the most part for most people doesn’t work the same for everybody, and that should be pretty clear. Because some people count calories and get nowhere, and other people count calories and it works. So, it’s pretty clear to me that it’s not an across the board like, think that works for everyone.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: Although it can give you a lot of information. But I talk about hormonal control, mostly insulin and leptin, but there are other hormones at work, as well, including digestive hormones like gastrin. So, I think that looking into where your hormones are where maybe that leptin set point could potentially give you some extra information as to what to eat and why, and how you could potentially be successful. But I think your point, Diane, about some people think they’re eating a lot, and maybe they’re not quite, and also to stretch out those extra bites over a much longer period of time versus stuffing yourself every day until you see some kind of result. I think that’s a really good point. And, potentially also an argument for looking at not just how much you’re taking in, calories being the easiest way to inform yourself as to how much you’re actually taking in, even though there is more to the story, but also an argument for digestive support, because maybe you’re not super hungry all the time because you’re stressed as all get out and you’re not producing stomach acid and your digestion is compromised so you get full really, really fast and you don’t want to eat so much. So, maybe you want to look at that. Why am I, you know…
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: Getting full so quickly. Well, it could definitely be because you’re not breaking down your food appropriately, so. And if you’re going to eat a ton and try and gain that way, I think the argument for digestive support is really, really strong because you do need to give your body the tools to deal with that extra food.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, and I, you know, I definitely don’t vote for, you know, attempting to be super human.
Liz Wolfe: Mmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: You know, like there’s kind of that case for, ok, here’s some things you could try and give it a good effort, 6 months, even a year where you’re trying to just maybe be a little bit more mindful of the stuff. And if it doesn’t get you anywhere, just leave well enough alone. You know?
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: Like, that’s your body, and it’s good enough as it is, and it will be good enough wherever you take it, you know? So, I think that’s part of, sometimes when we’re just trying too hard and fighting it. That’s just too much stress, so.
Liz Wolfe: I love that.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oye. Ok. We have two questions from dudes so far in this one. Woop!
Liz Wolfe: I know! It’s kind of exciting.
Diane Sanfilippo: Alright, Mark’s up next.
Liz Wolfe: Mark’s up. Oh, and P.S., not that I’m… I’m not trying to sell my skincare guide to people in the middle of the podcast.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: But, we just said “there’s an argument for digestive support”, and then I don’t want people to be like “but what does that mean?” You can Google it.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I also have a ton of information in the Purely Primal Skincare Guide on how to support, like, every single organ and system from top to tail, so.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: It’s out there.
Diane Sanfilippo: But I think, this is what happens. Wait till you see what happens when your book is, you wrote it so long ago. I’m like, “I think I wrote that in Practical Paleo too.” I’m pretty sure….
Liz Wolfe: You totally did.
Diane Sanfilippo: All that stuff is covered in the guide to digestion, as well in Practical Paleo where I kind of talk the same way just about every step of the way, so. You can get it in words and pictures, or in words and laughs, or
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} My book is not funny.
Liz Wolfe: Depends on what your currency is. Your literature currency.
Diane Sanfilippo: Word.
Liz Wolfe: You’re not alone, though. There’s help out there. {singing} You are not alone.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} oh gosh.
5. Opinions on natural sweeteners [28:58]
Liz Wolfe: Ok. Question from Mark.
Diane Sanfilippo: Poor Amanda.
Liz Wolfe: I know.
Diane Sanfilippo: Parenthesis, sings, comma, badly. I’m kidding {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: {laughing} Alright. Question from Mark. “There’s nothing like the sultry voices of Diane and Liz to keep a trucker awake on the road. Thanks ladies.”
Diane Sanfilippo: Yikes!
Liz Wolfe: Sultry, huh?
Diane Sanfilippo: What?
Liz Wolfe: I’ve never gotten that before.
Diane Sanfilippo: No.
Liz Wolfe: Should I try to be sultry? {deep husky voice} “I’ve been listening to…”
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t know what that means.
Liz Wolfe: I don’t know. For some reason, I’m like channeling Ethel Merman. Who knows. Alright. “I’ve been listening to the backlog of the Balanced Bites Podcast and love the talk on the different grades of milks. Whole, versus raw, versus skim, etc. I’d like to know your take on the different sweeteners available. Coconut versus cane versus beet sugar, agave, honey, raw or otherwise, and maple syrup. As truck drivers, we have to watch our weight to be compliant with federal medical standards. I’ve lost 30 pounds in the last 4 months on a mostly paleo diet, 40 pounds more to go. I could live and eat like this for the rest of my life easy, but one of the things I really miss are sweets. I indulge in the occasional dark chocolate, 85%, but I know there’s more to life than that. I have the feeling you’re going to advise me to ‘just say no to sweets’, and that’s ok too. Love the show, and hope to catch up to the latest episodes after the new year. Happy Holidays. Mark.” Well, Mark, after the new year, you’ll have a lovely surprise, because we’re answering your question right now!
Diane Sanfilippo: Woop, woop!
Liz Wolfe: Wo-hoo!
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Diane, do you want to speak to this one first?
Diane Sanfilippo: Um, you know, just quickly on his sort of matter of fact portion of the question before he asks about, you know, what his approach should be. My take, personally on different sweeteners available. This I know I cover in Practical Paleo as well as in the Sugar Detox book, even though on the Sugar Detox you’re not using any sweeteners. The only thing that you end up “sweetening” food with will just be green apple. But, I tend to think that the, well obviously man-made sweeteners are not anything I ever recommend folks use. So the stuff like Truvia, aspartame related things like Equal, or nothing like Splenda or Sweet n’ Low. Any of those colorful packets that you’re finding on the table at the diner at midnight, wait, what? Anyway.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: So, none of that stuff. I was at a diner this week. I was like, oh Jersey, I love you.
Liz Wolfe: In New Jersey? A diner?
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: No. I don’t believe that.
Diane Sanfilippo: What? Um, so, you know, that being said first and foremost for anybody who maybe is just tuning in for the first time and doesn’t know, you know, all of the stuff that we talk about, we’re definitely against the whole man-made, artificial sweetener thing. But when it comes to other sweeteners, which I will say are all sort of naturally derived, so whether it’s coconut sugar, cane sugar, beet sugar; beets tend to be genetically modified, so unless it’s organic, that’s one issue, if you don’t want to be eating GMO foods, then I would avoid sugar from beets that does not say that it’s organic specifically. And, other than that, agave is one of the ones that I tend to steer people away from, just because it’s so highly refined and higher in fructose, and I know it was very popular for diabetics when it first came out, I remember I actually kind of shot, like some kind of link to an article to a friend who has type 1 diabetes thinking this might be interesting for her, and then, you know, obviously years later in my studies learned that it doesn’t spike your blood sugar because it actually goes to your liver for much longer first for processing, which will have a longer term negative effect than something like a sugar that is more heavy in like glucose, for example, than in the fructose which gets processed by the liver first. So, that’s kind of the whole little shtick on agave. What I tend to use the most in my house is maple syrup. I don’t pronounce it “surup”. I think that’s weird.
Liz Wolfe: I know.
Diane Sanfilippo: Maple syrup is the nectar of the gods in my life, so {laughs} I think maple syrup is the best tasting and it actually has a very neutral flavor when you use it in a recipe. Now, a lot of my baking friends who are better at baking and know about the chemistry and texture of things will tell you that if a recipe calls for something granulated using a syrup form of sweetener may not work the same way, so your result won’t necessarily be like the beautiful picture in the book. And so in that case whether you want to use like an organic cane sugar or coconut sugar or something, you know, coconut palm sugar, one of those. I don’t really think it matters much either way. The only argument I’ve ever made for certain sweeteners over others in terms of, like, nutrient value, is not to say that, you know, maple syrup is more nutritious than white sugar, it’s just that it does carry some trace minerals and vitamins. And so, you’re not eating it for those vitamins and minerals, but I think it’s of value that there are some there. I just can’t say that that’s, it’s not going to be the main reason you use it, but I do think that it’s important. Molasses, specifically, is pretty rich in minerals. I’m not sure if I’m remembering correctly, it may also have some B-vitamin content.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: And again, it’s not like you’re downing a cup of molasses because you’re looking for the minerals and the vitamins, but, your body needs those vitamins and minerals to processes the carbohydrate to turn it into ATP, as Liz was talking about before, and so, I just feel like if you’re going to take in a sweetener, you may as well take in one that has something there with it. So, you know, even in that small amount that you’re going to use it. Now, if it’s once a year and you’re just using white sugar once a year, whatever, but I know that this question is more, you know, if I’m going to use a little bit here and there, because I know that’s what most of us tend to do. So that’s where I vote. I vote maple syrup or something like honey, but that has a very specific flavor profile, so it doesn’t always work in a recipe, for example. And then something like an organic cane sugar or coconut sugar or something like that. That’s where I am on the sugar and sweeteners.
Liz Wolfe: God forbid we are permissive about sweeteners, Diane.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh nooooo!
Liz Wolfe: Nooo!
Diane Sanfilippo: But on the Sugar Detox, there are no sweeteners. Anyway, what’s your advice for him in terms of his, he’s got 40 more pounds to go, and, you know, what’s your approach to kind of how he should handle that stuff.
Liz Wolfe: I just think he’s got a handle on it. He sounds balanced, he sounds enthused, and he sounds like he’s doing things steady.
Diane Sanfilippo: It sounds like he wants to introduce something else, so, you know, he’s lost 30 pounds in the last 4 months, 40 pounds to go. Those last 40 pounds are probably going to take longer than 4 months. Because we know the first 30 will come off faster. I mean, it’s just how it will go. So, it might take him another 6 months, maybe, to lose another 40 pounds. {laughs} I like that my analogy on things like this is a road trip, because he’s a truck driver.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: So, {laughs} this is a good one. But I tend to think that when you’re looking to achieve a result like weight loss, or fat loss, obviously in this case, I tend to think the more stops you take the longer it takes for you to get there. And so, you know, I tend to think, take the break when you get there, you know. If you could drive through without getting tired and needing gas to get where you’re going, you know, wouldn’t that be the best way to do it? If you’re not going to get tired, if your energy would stay sustained and you didn’t need to stop to sleep, and the fuel never needed to be, you know, be added in. If it was just always there, and you had that option, wouldn’t you take it? Because that’s the fastest way to get there. That being said, you know, if you want to just kind of maybe live a little more in the moment, and it’s not as important to you how fast you get there, then taking those little pit stops along the way, it will just make it take longer to get to where you’re going. And that’s up to you. You know what I mean?
Liz Wolfe: You want to stop and see the state’s largest rocking chair.
Diane Sanfilippo: You just might.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: And you might want to sit on that rocking chair and get a picture taken so you can Instagram it.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, come on.
Liz Wolfe: And tag us!
Diane Sanfilippo: And tag us! {laughs} So I mean, that’s what I think. Like, honestly, when I was working with more one on one clients, and kind of handling that and they would ask me the same question, I say, you know, when I was at a point where I needed to lose weight, and I had about 30 pounds to lose, I knew that if I just stayed focused and I told myself, you know, every day counts, stay focused, stick with your plan, and if this is working for you, especially with the occasional dark chocolate, you know, it’s not like you are living on some kind of super strict protocol. You know, you’ve got some fun in there {laughs} with your dark chocolate. And it’s working for you. I would stick with it, and then when you get to where you want to be, that’s where I say, you know what, then you can see what your threshold is. What is your 20% or 10% or 5% that, you know, having that treat now and then if you feel like having it you’re still going to be on track and you’re, you know, just fine with it. But that’s up to you. You know, you get to make that decision.
Liz Wolfe: I like, a lot. That’s a really, really good point. I like the road trip analogy.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: And obviously we’re not saying go drink a cup of maple syrup if you feel like pulling over and having that in your giant rocking chair.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Is there sugar in syrup?
Liz Wolfe: Yes.
Diane Sanfilippo: {sultry} Yes.
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I love it.
Diane Sanfilippo: Best movie ever?
Liz Wolfe: Best movie ever.
Diane Sanfilippo: Ever. Ever.
Liz Wolfe: We tried to watch it the other day, but I’m kind of resigned to the fact that my husband will never ever, ever watch a movie with me without falling asleep.
Diane Sanfilippo: Awww.
Liz Wolfe: I know. We tried Home Alone last night.
Diane Sanfilippo: Elf is so short, too.
Liz Wolfe: You’d think.
Diane Sanfilippo: It’s a really short movie. {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: No-no. You don’t know how quickly my husband can fall asleep.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I mean, it’s ridiculous.
Diane Sanfilippo: Scott can fall asleep quickly, but he’s not a napper. Interesting, right?
Liz Wolfe: That is interesting.
Diane Sanfilippo: He doesn’t nap. Maybe when he’s like, 70, and falling asleep on the couch to football after Thanksgiving dinner. Maybe.
Liz Wolfe: Maybe.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Ok.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, boy. Our poor dudes.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah, our poor dudes. Oh, you know what I was going to say, real quick.
Diane Sanfilippo: No.
Liz Wolfe: I know, I keep having asides here. With this whole, you know, question about sugar. We don’t know what he wants to put the sugar in. I would probably advocate doing something …
Diane Sanfilippo: His veins?
Liz Wolfe: His veins…
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: We don’t want you to shoot up. But, you know, having some good fat and some protein, or something like that with the sugar. Like, if your home and you make a batch of cookies, you know, God forbid, again, paleo cookies, make them with nuts and whatever. Nuts and some coconut flour.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Liz doesn’t know how to make paleo cookies!
Liz Wolfe: I don’t even know!
Diane Sanfilippo: It’s becoming very obvious right now. {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I’m thinking what goes in…
Diane Sanfilippo: How Liz makes paleo cookies is, open the roll, slice and bake!
Liz Wolfe: Yeah, exactly. Thank you Bill and Haley.
Diane Sanfilippo: The Primal Palate cookies.
Liz Wolfe: And there’s like 4 ingredients! That’s what I love about them! Ok, this is what I remember. My dad makes cookies, and he calls them his breakfast cookies, and it’s so cute because they are paleo cookies, and I love that he does this. But he makes them out of almond flour, a little bit of coconut flour, maple syrup, and super dark chocolate chips. And that’s…well, maybe some coconut oil. And that it’s! But you’ve got some decent protein from the nuts, some fiber from the coconut flour, which I’m totally fine with coconut flour, obviously, you know, a rare treat punctuating an otherwise healthy diet filled with whole foods, meats, veggies, etc., but you’ve got some fat, you’ve got some protein, and you’ve got a little bit of sweetness. And it shouldn’t be too dangerous in my opinion. I wouldn’t dump a bunch of sugar into, you know, a 5-hour energy, but I think that’s probably pretty obvious. There you go.
Diane Sanfilippo: The other thing, too, is that sometimes you’ll find treat recipes, and if they call for a lot of a sweetener, often you can reduce that. I mean, it might change the texture, I’m not a baker, like I’ve said, so maybe I’m screwing things up, but I’ve even seen some sort of paleo-friendly, grain-free recipes where it calls for a cup of maple syrup, and I’m like, I’m just going to use half. I think I’ll be ok with half.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: Because, when you are used to not eating a lot of sweetener, especially if you are making something for yourself, or like your family that you’re not taking somewhere that you’re worried someone is going to go crazy on you, like, {laughs} what was that Parks and Recreation clip, where it’s like, I’m not putting you in charge of dessert anymore.
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} The vegetable loaf?
Diane Sanfilippo: Something like that.
Liz Wolfe: Not only does this thing exist, but you’ve now deprived everyone of cake! {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} But like, if you’re making it for your own family and it’s got to be just a little bit sweet and not, you know, trying to mimic something else. Anyway, just something else to pay attention to. I usually reduce how much sweetener if it’s over, like, half a cup or so. It just kind of depends. Ok.
6. Sardines in the car [43:00]
Liz Wolfe: Very good. Alright, next up. This one is from a lovely, we’ve got a handle here. This is fun. Question from Dreaming of Meat in California. “Dear Diane and Liz. I’ve been a Balanced Bites follower for a few years now, and love your show. Wondering if you might be able to give me some advice. I work for an animal rescue nonprofit organization, and it’s great. I totally love what I do, and I couldn’t be happier. There’s just one aspect of the job that’s giving me a hard time. Because it’s an animal rescue nonprofit, it’s founders many years ago decided that the organization should be meat-free. This is pretty easy for me when work pays for lunch or gets takeout, but it also means that there’s no meat allowed in the office per office policy. That means I can’t take any leftovers, lunch, anything, and keep it anywhere in the office, including the fridge. I feel uncomfortable debating the policy since I’m newer here, and everyone else seems fine with it. I’ve been able to manage on veggies, sweet potatoes, etc., for lunch, but I’m finding that I’m getting bored and a little woozy for the lack of meat protein for 8+ hours at a time. I’ve worked for other animal rescue groups, and they’ve never banned meat in the workplace. This is a small group of women that make up the staff, and most of them have gone vegetarian or just eat pasta, sandwiches, etc., during lunch and snacks. As a paleo-er, and very dedicated to my lifestyle, do you have any suggestions for some good snacks or veggies meals to get me through the day. I can only eat so many hardboiled eggs a week. Any ideas you have would be great.” So, my idea is basically just wait for them all to fall asleep after their blood sugar crash from pasta, sandwiches, etc., and eat some sardines while they’re all napping.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh my goodness.
Liz Wolfe: Not really. Or, you can do what, uh, I shouldn’t be too specific. What someone who once worked on my hair at a very important day in my life used to do, which was to pour a bunch of vodka into a 7-11 cup
Diane Sanfilippo: Uh!
Liz Wolfe: {laughs} and make everybody think she’s drinking soda. Why don’t you just put a bunch of sardines in a 7-11 cup and slurp them up that way? I’m just kidding. Again. This is {laughs} this is a tough one. If it were me, I would probably, number one I would probably rely a lot on sardine, and I would probably go out to my car to eat them.
Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm. That’s exactly what I was going to say.
Liz Wolfe: Or eat them in the bathroom. I’d eat them in the bathroom. And I’d also probably just ask if they were ok with fish, or if they are ok with bivalves, which as Denise Minger points out in her book, Death by Food Pyramid, bivalves are technically not sentient creatures, so maybe you could have some scallops, some oysters, some clams, something like that and see if that would work.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I was definitely going to go with the eating in my car route.
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: I’m serious.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah!
Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, take a break, 10 minutes.
Liz Wolfe: In high school I ate lunch in the bathroom. I mean {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, I think if you’re eating sardines in the bathroom, somebody might now.
Liz Wolfe: {Laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, I think that’s also probably breaking the rules of bringing the food like, sort of on premise.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah.
Diane Sanfilippo: But I think in your car, like, I think it’s imposing on your rights to not allow you to eat it, even in your car. I mean, that’s…I don’t think that’s fair. I think that that’s mean, quite frankly. And, I think it’s ok if they want to make rules about within the workplace, you know? I mean, whatever. I just think if you’re going to do that in your car, like, you deserve to have some sort of sanctuary space that like, you can kind of not deal with anybody else’s imposed views on that stuff. That’s my take, and that’s what I would do if that were my situation. I just don’t like the idea of other people’s nonsense
Liz Wolfe: {laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} imposing on my ways. I mean, heck I’m the girl who brings my olive oil and my salt and whatever else into the restaurant, my coconut aminos and plop it right down on the table. I’m just like, not my problem if you’re concerned that I just brought some outside sauce into your restaurant {laughs} like, it’s just not my problem. So.
Liz Wolfe: Ooooohh.
Diane Sanfilippo: That’s what I would do.
Liz Wolfe: To be more like you. I wish I was more like you. Braver.
Diane Sanfilippo: Oh. Give it 5 years.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah, I guess you’re right.
Diane Sanfilippo: Maybe.
Liz Wolfe: Give it some time.
Diane Sanfilippo: I’ve never really been a rule follower though, Liz. I have to say.
Liz Wolfe: I believe it.
Diane Sanfilippo: Most of the time, I’m like, that rule is illegitimate. Like, punching a time clock in an office? I’m like, listen. I’ll punch a time clock on the sales floor when somebody else wants to leave because they are waiting for me to come in and cover my shift. But, because my desk is waiting for me is not a good enough reason.
Liz Wolfe: {Laughs}
Diane Sanfilippo: Like, I had it out with the manager when I worked in corporate America. I was like, you’re being ridiculous. If I’m here 10 minutes later and I stay 10 minutes later, there’s no reason for you to have problems with that. Like, that’s your problem not mine. Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: There are some national companies that have instituted very effective policies, much like the one you are suggesting now. I believe Best Buy is one of them, and I think it was kind of instrument in their becoming more salient in this difficult economy.
Diane Sanfilippo: What do you mean?
Liz Wolfe: I’m pretty sure that they have a “work when you want to work, just get it done” type policy.
Diane Sanfilippo: In the corporate office, maybe.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah, oh yeah. Not, well, I mean.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. Well I know…
Liz Wolfe: There was nobody there to show me iPhones the other day. Blame it on the “work when you want to work” policy.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Can you imagine? I know. This is like, totally a tangent, but I know Gary Vaynerchuk, who I’m completely obsessed with right now, and I forgot I have to tell you a story about this whole scenario, but anyway, that will be an off-air story, sorry listeners, because it’s just not podcast fodder. But, I’ve been like listening to his audio books and kind of following his stuff. And his company, VaynerMedia, he has a rule where it’s like you’re vacation time, it’s just take as much vacation as you want or need. Like, everybody who works at his company is, you know, a driven individual, and probably has some entrepreneurial spirit even though they are working at this company, and they can take vacation as they want it, but you know, they are driven people and they need to get their work done and they get their work done in the time that they need. I was like, that’s how I live in my own, you know, entrepreneurial life, and I feel like that’s such an amazing, I don’t know, what an amazing gift to give your employees that you trust them enough
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: To say, like, I know you’re going to work hard for my company for our company, we do this together, and I don’t know, I just thought that was really cool. This is a total tangent, but interesting stuff, right?
Liz Wolfe: If only the military operated that way, I could have a lot more fun.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Yes.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}
Liz Wolfe: There you go.
Diane Sanfilippo: Anyway.
Liz Wolfe: So basically, sardines in the car, right?
Diane Sanfilippo: Sardines in the car. That was, you know, a 10-minute answer for…
Liz Wolfe: That’s going to be a new hash tag.
Diane Sanfilippo: Sardines in the car. Four words?
Liz Wolfe: Yup. New hash tag. #sardinesinthecar. Somebody use it. Somebody use it!
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Sardines on a plane.
Liz Wolfe: {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: I’m sick of this mother**** sardines on this mother **** plane {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} We need to make a, is it Samuel L. Jackson?
Liz Wolfe: Yeah.
Diane Sanfilippo: We need to make like a meme about all the places we’re eating sardines that irritate people {laughs}.
Liz Wolfe: Oh, that would be amazing.
Diane Sanfilippo: There you go.
Liz Wolfe: Sorry airplane seatmate that I spilled sardine juice on you in a turbulent flight.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}
Liz Wolfe: Ok.
Diane Sanfilippo: Sorry I’m not sorry.
7. The best calcium supplement [50:42]
Liz Wolfe: Sorry I’m not sorry. So, this next one I think will be, we’ll see, this might be the last one.
Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.
Liz Wolfe: This question is from either Allie or Ollie. I apologize for getting it wrong if I got it wrong. “Hi. I’ve had issues in the past with disordered eating. This has affected my health in many ways; however, the most detrimental I feel is the considerable amount of bone loss that occurred. I’m pretty young, in my early 20s, and I have osteopenia. I’m highly concerned about this, and would like to regain full bone density as soon as possible. I do eat a whole food diet, but I feel I might need to supplement for a while to help my body heal. Please, what in your opinion is a quality calcium supplement that is best absorbable for the body? I eat a good deal of dark green and orange vegetables. This probably makes up the majority of my diet. I eat fish almost every day, usually sardines or canned salmon because it’s easy. Two or three times a week I eat shellfish as well as red meat. I eat eggs on a daily basis, and eat fermented dairy every other day. I exercise daily as I feel it helps me sleep. In regards to sleep, I aim for at least 8 hours a night. Sometimes I’ll get 7, and sometimes I’ll get 10, but I try to at least give myself as much time to sleep as I possibly can.” I’m going to… you and I might have different takes on this, but my opinion is she’s probably doing what she needs to do for long term effectiveness. I would not recommend… I, ok, this is touchy because I don’t want to say I would recommend or not recommend something, but if it were me, I would not rely on a calcium supplement, because there are so many other cofactors that are critical for calcium retention and building bones. So vitamin A, vitamin D, calcium, magnesium, and so on and so forth, fatty acids and all that stuff. So, getting these nutrients from whole foods I think is a fantastic way to go. I think raw milk provides a great source of calcium and vitamins A and D which are important to get together, and I actually talk about this quite a bit in my book. I talk about, I have a whole section on calcium, vitamins A and D, how they work together, and you’re getting a good amount of calcium from, hopefully, the whole sardines, the dark green vegetables are a great source of magnesium, the fermented dairy is great, so in my opinion, if it were me, I probably would not seek a calcium supplement. Diane, what’s your thought? By the way, you’re muted.
Diane Sanfilippo: Booooo.
Liz Wolfe: Just in case you want people to hear what you’re saying. {laughing}
Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. I was like, am I muted? Am I muted? Obviously I was.
Liz Wolfe: That’s good. I’ll cut it out.
Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} you won’t.
Liz Wolfe: Nah.
Diane Sanfilippo: That’s not true. No, I just, I’m pretty much right on track with you. I mean, I think it’s so much more important to be concerned about all of those cofactors. I think one book we’ve probably pointed people to in the past also is Vitamin K2 and the Calcium Paradox. So, that’s one, you know, for somebody who is really more specifically in learning about the calcium issue, I think that might be a good book to read. I mean, obviously, you’re going to cover a lot of that, I’ve covered a few things on it in Practical Paleo, but I think that might be a good one to read because it’s going to get into so many more details, so that might be helpful. I don’t know, I think that’s pretty much it.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah. The reason I wanted to answer this question is because it was so specific, what in your opinion is a quality calcium supplement?
Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm.
Liz Wolfe: But I think we both feel that it’s the calcium with the cofactors.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.
Liz Wolfe: That’s really the most important thing.
Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I think so. And, you know, this might be a case too where every, I don’t know, 6 months or so, if she’s getting her bone density checked out, you know, see what the progress is on that.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: I mean, you have to watch what’s happening there and work with your doctor in that way to make sure what you’re doing is giving you some progress.
Liz Wolfe: And I would also say, she says she exercises daily. We don’t know the intensity of that exercise, or what that exercise is.
Diane Sanfilippo: Is it weight bearing, or yeah.
Liz Wolfe: Yeah. Forgiving weight bearing exercise, I mean I wouldn’t, I really wouldn’t hammer myself with cardiovascular exercise
Diane Sanfilippo: Right.
Liz Wolfe: In this type of situation I would do weight bearing activity and walking.
Diane Sanfilippo: Right, and taking it slowly with doing that in some ways. Obviously she’s got some issues and concerns about the bone density
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.
Diane Sanfilippo: You know, it’s important to do that stuff to build and maintain bone density, that weight bearing exercise, but we don’t want anyone who’s concerned about the weakness of their bones to {laughs} get in and try and overdo it, either.
Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm. Definitely. I think that will do it then. Anything else, Diane, before we close out?
Diane Sanfilippo: Uh, next week is an episode with Chris Kresser, so make sure you tune in for that one.
Liz Wolfe: Fabulous. So that’s it. We’ll be back next week with Chris Kresser talking about his new book. If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, please help us spread the word by leaving a review in iTunes. It helps keep the show in front of people, plus we like to read about all the weird things you do while you listen to the show. So until next week, you can find Diane at You can find me, Liz, at And you can preorder my book on Amazon, Eat the Yolks. Thanks for listening. We’ll be back next week.

Thanks for listening!
Liz & Diane

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